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By Anthony Cody.

Last night at the Democratic presidential debate, attention turned to K12 education. Both candidates addressed two questions. The first came from a Detroit parent. Here is the transcript (thank you to the New York Times):

COOPER: I want to bring in Shoniqua Kemp. She’s right here — Ms. Kemp. Her 14-year-old daughter Imani is a student in Detroit. Shoniqua is one of ten parents suing Detroit public schools — not for money, she says, but to improve conditions.

She says she’s currently leaning towards Senator Sanders. Her question will go to both of you, but we’ll start with Senator Sanders. Ms. Kemp?

QUESTION: Thank you. Speaking of opportunities for success, in Detroit, schools open and close with no accountability to — or transparency to the communities that it — they service. Not only that — in our schools, as you’ve stated, we have issues with rats, mold, no working water fountains, not to mention non- certified teachers, lack of accountability around transportation and special education, and so much more. With that said, our students can no longer suffer due to lack of these things, or having these dilapidated issues take place. So, my question is who’s going to step up? Who’s going to ensure that the policies procedures are put in place that will ensure, and bring forth a successful future for our students because my daughter cannot wait eight more years for success to take place at your hands. At the leader’s hands.

COOPER: Senator Sanders, let’s start with you.

SANDERS: Well, thank you very much for not being resigned to that horrendous situation, but being prepared to stand up and fight back…

QUESTION: … Thank you…

(APPLAUSE)

SANDERS: … That’s what we need all over this country.

And, let me be very honest with you, hard thing to say, but it is true. A great nation is judged not by how many millionaires and billionaires it has, but by how it treats the most vulnerable amongst us, and that is the children, and that is the elderly. And, do you know what?

We should be ashamed of how we treat our kids and our senior citizens.

QUESTION: Thank you.

(APPLAUSE)

SANDERS: We have a Republican leadership in congress now fighting for hundreds of billions of dollars in tax breaks for the top two-tenths of one percent, but somehow we can’t come up with the money to fix Detroit’s crumbling public school system. Somehow we cannot make sure that Detroit has qualified, and good teachers.

Somehow we can’t make sure that there are summer programs for your children, and after school programs for your children. Somehow we cannot do what other countries around the world, is provide quality childcare and pre-K. We have got to change our national priorities, no more tax breaks for billionaires, and large corporations.

We are going to invest in our children, and have the best public school system in the world.

COOPER: Senator Sanders, before we go to Secretary Clinton — Senator Sanders, let me just follow up with you. As president, you have to decide where to spend your political capital. There’s a lot of things you want to do, where does fixing Mrs. Kim’s daughter’s school and other schools, where does that lay in your list of things to do…

SANDERS: … Anderson, not only do we have a crumbling school system in Detroit, and in many other areas, we have — and everybody in this room should be embarrassed by this, we have the highest rate of childhood poverty of almost any major country on Earth. That is a disgrace.

(APPLAUSE)

SANDERS: So, when you ask me about my priorities, my priorities are that no, we’re not going to give tax breaks to the wealthy. We’re going to ask them to start paying their fair share of taxes so we can raise the money to make sure that every child in this country, in Detroit, in Vermont, gets the quality education that he or she deserves.

(APPLAUSE)

COOPER: Secretary Clinton?

CLINTON: Mrs. Kim (ph), here is what I would do as president. Number one, I would reinstate a program we did have during the 1990’s where the federal government provided funding to repair and modernize public schools because a lot of communities can’t afford to do that on their own.

(APPLAUSE)

CLINTON: Secondly, I would use every legal means at my disposal to try to force the Governor and the state to return the schools to the people of Detroit — to end the emergency management…

(APPLAUSE) (CHEERING)

CLINTON: … which, I believe, if you look at the data, the situation has only gotten worse with these emergency managers that have put the system further in debt.

(APPLAUSE)

CLINTON: Number three, I want to set-up inside the Department of Education, for want of a better term, kind of an education SWAT team, if you will. Where we’ve got qualified people, teachers, principals, maybe folks who are retired, maybe folks who are active, but all of whom are willing to come and help. When Detroit gets back their schools, they should have all the help they can get to be able to get teachers in the classroom, to be able to find spaces while schools are being repaired. And, I also would look at how we could through the federal government support more teachers because we’re going to have a teacher shortage in some of the hardest to teach districts…(APPLAUSE)

COOPER: … (inaudible)

CLINTON: … including Detroit.

COOPER: Let me just follow up with the Secretary and then I’ll come back to you.

Secretary Clinton, you’ve been endorsed by two of the biggest teachers’ unions. There’s an awful lot of great teachers in this country. It’s an incredibly difficult job, one of the most difficult jobs there is but union rules often make it impossible fire bad teachers and that means disadvantaged kids are sometimes taught by the least qualified. Do you think unions protect bad teachers?

CLINTON: You know, I am proud to have been endorsed by the AFT and the NEA, and I’ve had very good relationship with both unions, with their leadership. And we’ve really candid conversations because we are going to have to take a look at — what do we need in the 21st century to really involve families, to help kids who have more problems than just academic problems?

A lot of what has happened and honestly it really pains me, a lot of people have blaming and scape-goating teachers because they don’t want to put the money into the schools system that deserve the support that comes from the government doing it’s job.

COOPER: So just to follow up, you don’t believe unions protect bad teachers?

CLINTON: You know what – I have told my friends at the top of both unions, we’ve got take a look at this because it is one of the most common criticisms. We need to eliminate the criticism.

You know, teachers do so much good, they are often working under most difficult circumstances. So anything that could be changed, I want them to look at it. I will be a good partner to make sure that whatever I can do as president, I will do to support the teachers of our country.

COOPER: Senator Sanders?

SANDERS: What our campaign is about, is asking people to think big not small. And when we think big and we talk about education, we’ve got to ask ourselves a simple question, how is it — starting at college that hundreds of thousands of bright young people are today, unable to go to college because they can’t afford it? How is it that maybe your kid — and when I was growing up, we didn’t have any money — we’re not even dreaming about going to college because they knew it was another world.

So starting with the top, now I know some people think it’s a radical idea, I don’t. I believe that every public college and university in this country should be tuition free.

(APPLAUSE)

So that your child regardless of the income of your family knows that if she studies hard, she is going to be able to go to college. And you know what else we do? We invest in child care. Right now, you’ve got child-care workers making McDonald’s wages, that is crazy.

COOPER: Thank you Senator.

SANDERS: I want well trained, well paid, child care workers to give our youngest kids advance opportunities.

My thoughts. In response to the Detroit parent, Clinton gets credit for calling out and opposing the emergency manager of the Detroit public schools. One of her strengths as a candidate is that she (and her staff) do their homework and get specific about local issues. On the other hand, her idea of a Department of Education “SWAT team” is a bit terrifying, honestly. The idea of the Department of Education mustering a cadre of retired teachers to rescue hapless districts sounds a bit far fetched. And the image of a SWAT team is even less appealing. Such interventions rarely work out well.

Sanders gets credit for thanking the questioner for standing up and fighting back. He also pushes a strong agenda for higher taxes on the wealthy which would go towards rebuilding schools and the nation’s infrastructure.

Anderson Cooper’s second question states a falsehood that has become accepted wisdom. He said “unions protect bad teachers.” To be clear, union contracts provide teachers with the right to due process. The idea that schools are held back by large numbers of bad teachers has been one of the main drivers of recent reforms, and they have yielded no positive results — just crushed the morale of the profession, and pushed turnover ever higher. Neither candidate took the opportunity to debunk this.

But Hillary Clinton gave a response that every teacher should wonder about. She said we need to “eliminate the criticism.” How exactly will she eliminate that criticism? The basis for the criticism is that teachers are protected by due process and seniority. The only way to satisfy those who are making this bogus criticism would be to eliminate or greatly weaken these protections so that teachers can be fired much more easily. I would really like to know how Clinton intends to go about eliminating this criticism, while still genuinely supporting teachers.

Sanders, on the other hand, focused his attention more on college and pre-school, missing the opportunity to address K12 education issues directly. While I think Sanders offers a greater chance for change from the status quo, he still has a lot of room for growth in his education agenda.

Author

Anthony Cody

Anthony Cody worked in the high poverty schools of Oakland, California, for 24 years, 18 of them as a middle school science teacher. He was one of the organizers of the Save Our Schools March in Washington, DC in 2011 and he is a founding member of The Network for Public Education. A graduate of UC Berkeley and San Jose State University, he now lives in Mendocino County, California.

Comments

  1. Arthur Camins    

    Frankly, Anthony, I found the answers from both of them far too vague. (I share your horror at the SWAT team idea, as it assumes a “let us outside experts fix you because you are broken,” stance). This is disappointing because there is no shortage of specific policies and programs that could make significant improvements. I know you have proposed some. Here is what I wish they would say: http://www.arthurcamins.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/The-K-12-Education-Speech-We-Need-from-Democrats.pdf

  2. rbeckley58    

    Tony, thanks for the reasoned analysis. I too was alarmed at the idea of SWAT teams – too reminiscent of Michelle Rhee, et al.

    Arthur, great summary of the issues as well. Worth reading.

  3. Susan Lee Schwartz    

    Here’s a reply for you. 
    http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Weapons-of-Mass-Deception-in-Best_Web_OpEds-Deception_Education_Future_Ideas-160306-756.html

    http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/LAUSD-TEACHER-SHORTAGE–in-Best_Web_OpEds-Education_Education-Funding_Educational-Crisis_For-profit-Education-160307-710.html#comment586872

    Look at LAUSD, a decade after they removed  tens of thousands of veteran teachers by fabricating charges and the union UTLA looked on and did nothing!
    LAUSD is the SECOND largest school district in the US; IT WAS targeted for privatization AND has been under assault for a decade.

    Perdaily.com tells this sad story, and explains how the union collaborated to rid the system of THE VOICE OF THE PROFESSIONAL BY EMPTYING THE SCHOOLS of the veteran educators. It has always been about money…
       http://www.perdaily.com/2014/03/lausd-and-utla-collude-to-end-collective-bargaining-and-civil-rights-for-teachers-part-2.html

    It  happened to me, not only a celebrated teacher in NYC 
    http://www.opednews.com/author/author40790.html  
     I was the  1998 NYS Educator of Excellence (NYSEC)  and in “Who’s Who Among America’s Teachers,”) as they moved to charge me with incompetence,–   but first to  ‘rubberize’ me for 2 years. They removed a teacher from the practice, in my case one that I made famous as the NYC cohort for the New Standards (Pew) w Harvard). Before  bringing that charge,  they removed the teacher, literally incarcerating them, so all students and parents who could testify to the absurdity of charges had moved on. 

    No One stopped them in NYC from destroying the most wonderful teachers. NYC is the largest district (IN THE 15,880 )  where first they made war on teachers.  The number of systems lets them work their dirty work at the local level.
     http://www.perdaily.com/2011/01/lausd-et-al-a-national-scandal-of-enormous-proportions-by-susan-lee-schwartz-part-1.html

    Of all the lies that proliferate today, the mendacity of the  DOE administration  at all levels, in NYC, stands at the top of  DECEPTION and uncivil practices.
    .. the result

    Principals from hell reigned in NYC and across the nation as Lorna Stremcha knows, https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10207773014514667&set=gm.1008992552502493&type=3&theater
    They followed orders, enforcing mandates from above,  bullion teachers who had no LEGAL  legs to stand on ..
    http://blog.ebosswatch.com/2013/05/one-womans-legal-fight-against-workplace-bullying/

    “The NY Teacher” and its online site,  documented the  insanity, even as the Daily News talked about those  ‘bad teachers that the unions protected!”
    HILLARY SAY WAS RIGHT… there are MORE THATN STORIES — about those “unions” 
    THERE IS 20 YEARS OF HARD EVIDENCE and the DISAPPEARANCE OR TENS of THOUSANDS of VETERAN teachers!
    YOU bet, this ‘union’ failure is not going to disappear.
    New unions must rise, like in NYC where Francesco Portelos is running. Because here was the union  in Los Angeles: http://www.perdaily.com/2014/03/lausd-and-utla-collude-to-end-collective-bargaining-and-civil-rights-for-teachers-part-2.html

    SO, WITHOUT UNIONS and with the veterans ELIMINATED , along comes VAM and the Common Core crap to bollux the rest of the new, young recruits…TFA and such.

     Lenny Isenberg in Los Angeles,  nailed how the media IGNORED the utter corruption and destruction A DECADE AGO!
    http://www.perdaily.com/2014/03/have-reporters-become-poli-ticks–the-media-parasites-of-the-body-politic.html

    As he  says “it was always OUT THERE…the truth!”
     And it was, and it is —  EVEN AS  Lenny fights on TAKING THE UNION TO COURT!
     http://www.perdaily.com/2016/02/appellant-leonard-isenberg-a-teacher.html

    What a magnificent site  is Perdaily.com — with all its evidence of corruption, and the brilliant essays by the erudite Lenny
     Never read his work?
    Start here: http://www.perdaily.com/2014/06/lausds-treacherous-road-from-reed-to-vergara–its-never-been-about-students-just-money.html

    YUP, it was  OUT THERE , as Lenny CHRONICLED the corruption in LAUSD, as he  POINTED  first, TO  DESTRUCTIVE  social promotion  http://www.perdaily.com/2014/07/between-dishonest-social-promotion-of.html     —making himself a target… and they got’im!  
     Sleazy Deasy did!  .http://www.perdaily.com/2010/02/yesterday-i-was-removed-from-class-in-handcuffs.html 

    But, Lenny Isenberg  went on to chronicle the way they fabricated charges:
     http://www.perdaily.com/2014/03/lausd-continues-to-target-teachers.html
    http://www.perdaily.com/2014/02/ 
     and blackmailed teachers:   http://www.perdaily.com/2015/07/lausd-blacklisting-teachers–how-they-do-it.html
    http://www.perdaily.com/2014/07/former-ctc-attorney-kathleen-carroll-lays-out-unholy-alliance-between-union-and-public-education-pri.html

    http://www.perdaily.com/2013/10/why-does-utla-continue-to-support-lausds-violation-of-california-teacher-dismissal-process.html

    Yes, OF ALL the  destructive, hidden agendas in this Nation, the war on teachers is the most EVIL!
    https://lornastremcha.wordpress.com/2016/03/07/abuse-beyond/

    It takes out fine Americans from a crucial profession, dooms the children who are OUR FUTURE CITIZENS to ignorance AND HANDS THE  CRUCIAL JB OF EDUCATION OUR PEOPLE TO THE VERY PEOPLE WHO WANT TO CONTROL THEM.

    It ENDS DEMOCRACY!

    http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Weapons-of-Mass-Deception-in-Best_Web_OpEds-Deception_Education_Future_Ideas-160306-756.html

  4. Robert D. Skeels * rdsathene    

    Anderson Cooper should be more concerned that we don’t ask about how consolidation and corporate control of the media protects bad journalists like himself.

  5. Ira Shor    

    Arthur is right, both answers don’t get close to the crisis in k-12 public education. The Democratic Party wanted k-12 off the table for this presidential election season and both teacher union chiefs Randi/Lily of AFT/NEA did everything to make k-12 invisible, quickly endorsing Hillary without asking for rank-and-file voting on this and without asking Hillary for an education platform that would rescue teachers and public schools from the privatization war being waged against them. The corporate mainstream of both parties rushed the abominable ESSA to passage so no opposition could stand in the way of both main parties wanting nothing done about public schools, the Dems for their part eager to give cover to Obama’s disastrous education policies.

  6. Arthur Camins    

    High on the list of education topics the candidates seem to want to avoid discussing in depth is charter schools. As I argued here: (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arthur-camins/hopers-are-the-real-pragm_b_9376324.html) charter schools seem to be a political third rail. Bill de Blasio ventured onto those tracks and got burned. Hillary Clinton put her toe in those waters and nearly got it bitten off. The issue is not simply transparency and oversight, but more substantively that charter schools are– at best– a partial and often segregative solution for a few kids in a society that refuses to solve any equity issue systemically.

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